The average percentage of wedding guests who attend typically falls between 70 percent and 85 percent. To determine the number of people to invite, consider the average wedding attendance rate. On average, 83% of guests indicated they were coming to a user’s weddings while 17% of invitees declined their invitation. This means that if you have a 100-person guest list, you can expect 83 guests.
On average, between 15 and 20 percent of guests will RSVP no to a wedding. Experts are saying couples should be prepared to host 100% of the people they invite. When planning a wedding, it is important to plan on everyone coming and to be prepared to accommodate any last-minute drop-outs. Factors like location, date, time, and budget can also affect attendance rates.
When inviting too many guests, there are two main causes for concern: venue capacity and budget. A good rule of thumb is that around 10-20% of invitees may not attend, but this figure is subject to change based on individual situations.
The average wedding guest list in 2021 is around 167 people, with smaller weddings usually hovering around 50 people, while larger celebrations can reach up to 300 or more. Use RSVPify’s guest list calculator to get an estimate of how many guests you can expect to accept your wedding invitation and attend the Big Day.
In conclusion, the total number of invited guests and the percentage of guests who actually attend are two different numbers. It is crucial to plan accordingly and be prepared to accommodate any last-minute drop-outs.
📹 Most people DON’T WANT RELATIONSHIPS: understanding the decline in romantic relationships
The rates of sex and marriage — especially among young adults — have fallen to historically unprecedented lows and show no …
Is it a big deal to miss a wedding?
Make it up to the couple. You may have a good reason for missing the wedding, but you may still feel guilty. Call or write to say you’re sorry. Apologize and don’t make excuses. Lam says you should still send a wedding gift to the couple. Send it as soon as you can!
Is it disrespectful to not go to a wedding?
5. You’re one of hundreds invited. If you’ve been invited to a 500-person wedding and don’t know the people who invited you or can’t afford to go, you can say no without hurting anyone’s feelings. If you think your invitation was just to make the guest list look bigger, you’re probably right.
6. You’re not close friends. Maybe you don’t want to be friends with someone anymore. Not wanting to go to someone’s wedding shows you’re fine with the friendship ending. (But saying no to a wedding to send a message is passive-aggressive and not recommended!) If you don’t want to go to a wedding, that’s okay.
How do you estimate how many people will come to a wedding?
For weddings and social events. Plan for 85% of local guests to attend. Include spouses and children if they are invited!
Plan on 55% of out-of-town guests attending. If most of them are close family, your estimate could be higher—as high as 85%. Use this equation to estimate guests: Multiply the number of out-of-town guests by 0.55 and the number of local guests by 0.85 to get the total estimate.
What percent of people come to a wedding?
How many guests will come? Most local guests attend weddings. Out-of-town guests or destination weddings will have fewer guests. Some couples add about 10% to 20% to their guest list. Some create a second list of guests after they get RSVPs. Send save-the-date cards early to get a sense of the number of A-list attendees. What’s next? We can help. You should now know how many people to invite to your wedding. Time to choose a wedding venue. Wedgewood Weddings & Events venues are in California, Arizona, Colorado, Texas, Nevada, and New England. You’ll find venues that can accommodate over 200 guests—which are a rarity! You can also make a larger venue feel more intimate, so your party of 75 feels like they have space to relax.
How many people will no show at a wedding?
How common are no-shows at weddings? About 5-10% of people who RSVP “yes” to your wedding invitation won’t show up. This may shock you, but it’s true. Emergencies happen, dates get mixed up, and cars fail to start. If you’re having a small wedding with 40 guests, you may get only two or three no-shows. A large wedding with 200 guests may end up with only 180. That’s a lot of empty seats. This figure can vary from wedding to wedding. Weddings with the most no-shows include:
• Weekday weddings• Weddings held at busy times of year• Destination weddings (held abroad)• Winter weddings (bad weather) At this point, you may be worried. Don’t worry too much. No-shows won’t ruin your wedding. Plan what to do if guests don’t show up.
How many guests actually come to a wedding?
“It’s not an exact science,” she said. Most wedding guests attend. Buckley said that 85% of local guests, 55% of out-of-town guests, and 35% of destination wedding guests will show up. But then it gets confusing. Intimate weddings get near-perfect attendance, while bigger ones get less. If you have over 200 guests, you may only have 75 percent in attendance. If you have time, factor in the bride and groom’s relationship with each guest to get a more accurate estimate. No matter how many guests you think will come, prepare a budget for 100 percent attendance.
What is a good excuse to not attend a wedding?
In a perfect world, you’d never have to say no to a wedding invitation. But other things sometimes get in the way of your fun! We wanted to find a solution to this wedding etiquette problem once and for all. There are many reasons to decline a wedding invitation. You may not have the money, you don’t know the couple well, or you have another wedding on the same weekend. We’ve created this guide to help you. By the end of this post, you’ll know how to politely decline a wedding invitation without feeling guilty. How to Say No to a Wedding Invitation: The rules. DO: Think about it for a few days. If you’ve thought about it, you’ll feel better about declining. The couple will appreciate this. Think about your relationship with them. If you’re close to the couple getting married, tell them over dinner or by phone. If you don’t know them well, just say yes. Thank them for inviting you. You must be honest about why you’re declining. If you’re pregnant and can’t travel, it can be tricky to tell friends and family you’re pregnant. If you’re close with the couple, you might feel like lying, but generally, being honest gets a better response. If you tell them you’re struggling financially or uncomfortable about attending because your ex is in the wedding party, they won’t react badly. It’s fine to keep it vague, especially if you’re not close with the couple. A four-paragraph account of your upcoming business trip is just as effective as the phrase “work commitments.”
How many people statistically show up to a wedding?
About 75-85% of guests will attend. Send save-the-dates six to eight months in advance to give guests time to prepare. This will increase the number of people who will attend. The average wedding size depends on many things. One of the biggest ones? How many guests actually come? Planning your wedding is fun. From flowers to rings, planning your wedding is fun, creative, and important. Then there’s the guest list. Many couples find it stressful to make their wedding guest list. How many people should I invite? Can my venue hold this many guests? Will my second cousin’s childhood best friend be mad if she’s not invited?
How many people will not come to a wedding?
Wedding guest counts can be tricky to estimate. About 20% of your guests will say they can’t come to your wedding. However, some things can make the percentage go up or down.
Location. If your wedding is far from most guests, you might get more no-shows. For destination weddings, you can expect everyone who RSVPs to come. They have to make travel plans and spend money, so they’ll probably come.
Example: My clients had their wedding in Kalamazoo, where no guests lived. People had to travel from 45 minutes to across the country. They invited 294, 189 said yes, and 189 came. They had 9 cancellations the week of, but they made up for it.
What percentage of RSVPs show up at a wedding?
How many wedding guests RSVP yes? The number of guests who say they will attend a wedding varies a lot. Some studies say 83% will come, while others say it could be as low as 60% or as high as 85%. We asked The Knot Senior Editor Hannah Nowack, a former wedding pro, to weigh in. She said 80% is the sweet spot for guest attendance. A few people might back out at the last minute. Keep in mind: If you think some guests might not come, your budget and venue should be big enough for everyone. What percent of wedding guests decline? How many guests will say no to an invitation? Nowack says that 20% of guests usually decline wedding invitations. I’ve seen this at weddings. If eight to 10 friends are invited to a wedding, a few will probably say no. This number can vary, but start at 20% and adjust your estimate. As Nowack said, how many guests decline your wedding invitations depends on many things. Your wedding planner can help you plan for this. Use The Knot Guest List Tool to track responses.
📹 The reason people don’t like you.
You’re not everyone’s cup of tea. Here’s a free meditation for confidence and empowerment: …
The rates of sex and marriage — especially among young adults — have fallen to historically unprecedented lows and show no signs of stopping. Why is this happening? My theory is that most people don’t really want relationships. Rather: they want what relationships can get them. And if they can get those things more easily, more cheaply, and more safely in other places than relationships, they will do so. In this episode, I make a case that this is precisely what men and women are doing, albeit in different ways.\r \r Social Media\r Facebook: facebook.com/profile.php?id=100090053889622\r LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/orion-taraban-070b45168/\r Instagram: instagram.com/psyc.hacks\r Twitter: twitter.com/oriontaraban\r Website: oriontarabanpsyd.com\r Orion’s Theme: youtube.com/watch?v=WrXBzQ2HDEQ\r \r Thinking of going to grad school? Check out STELLAR, my top-rated GRE self-study program based on the world’s only empirically-validated test prep system. Use the code “PSYCH” for 10% off all membership plans: stellargre.com.\r \r GRE Bites: youtube.com/@grebites4993\r \r Become a Psychonaut and join PsycHack’s member community:\r youtube.com/channel/UCSduXBjCHkLoo_y9ss2xzXw/join\r \r Book a paid consultation:\r oriontarabanpsyd.com/consultations\r \r Sponsor an episode:\r oriontarabanpsyd.com/sponsor-an-episode\r \r Sound mixing/editing by: valntinomusic.com\r \r Presented by Orion Taraban, Psy.
Absolutely spot on. I’d also add that instead of wanting a relationship, too many people nowadays just want their own personal validation provider.. They want all of the perks of having partner without any of the sacrifice, compromise, self-improvement, and understanding the other person’s needs. Not enough people truly know how to GIVE anymore, it’s all “me, me, me”
I’ve been in relationships throughout my 20’s and into my early 40’s. I looked back at how my happiest and most productive years were when I was single. The longer I stayed single, the happier I was. Now I’m 55 and my mortgage is paid off, I run my own successful business, I’m healthy and fit and life is very good. I credit that to staying single and avoiding the stress of living up to someone else’s expectations of me while being in a relationship that I get absolutely nothing out of. Life is only as good as your life choices.
I don’t watch porn and do not consider myself MGTOW or ‘pilled’ or whatever other trend. I am just tired of all these games people play in dating and relationships. I offer my 6Fs (fit, friendly, financially stable, faithful, fertile, family-oriented) and expect the same in return. Take it or leave it.
Online is over taking real life. Hence Amazon (rather than stores), Google (rather than libraries), OF (rather than divorce), work from home (rather than offices). Kids who have seen their moms struggle as single moms and/or dad getting financially destroyed in divorce/ child support/ custody, are growing up and opting out of this BS.
Everyone’s bemoaning this state of affairs as if relationships always used to be great and we’re just too lazy to bother these days. I remember seeing my grandparents relationship and finding it depressing even as a small child. My parents spent a lot of time shouting at each other, even though we had some good times too, but in the end my dad left for someone else and has had a completely miserable relationship for the last 30 years. My own limited experience has been extremely lacklustre. People are doing what’s rational, the same people that maintained what I’m sure were often very unhealthy relationships in the past would act precisely the same as the people rejecting relationships today given the same circumstances. People are just people. If people are rejecting relationships it’s very likely because in fact most relationships suck and it’s a good thing there are less of them.
I just want love, man. I don’t need sex or a meaningless relationship status to be happy, I never have. Even after all this time I’ve avoided both, because emotional closeness and genuine love is all I really need from a woman, and after all this time I still haven’t found what I’m looking for. You can call it high standards, but if I honestly can remain happy throughout my life without it, as I have been so far, why settle?
I can do without sex. I just want to find someone who will stick around in my life this time. I just can’t stand the process of meeting new girls, getting to know each other, sometimes falling in love, and then poof, they are gone again. I want someone to hug and to get the inside jokes and to be able to rely on.
It’s true for me. I’m 49 and I gave up on sex and relationships very early on, probably ~30 years ago. I had porn as an outlet, so never bothered putting energy into the risky business of appealing to women. This impacted on my drive to seek work, because I just needed enough to maintain myself. In ”another life”, I probably could have found a woman if I’d put in the effort. I’m average looking, but large framed and 6’4″ and reasonably intelligent. I’m socially awkward in the realm of dating, but have no desire to improve myself. But my situation beats marrying a woman who needs a financial cushion and is only marginally into me.
You hit the nail on the head when you talked about jobs–that is exactly what is happening right now in the workplace. People are finding alternate ways of making money. And you are right about most people not really wanting relationships–because they can get what they want in other ways. This creates a BIG problem for those of us who do want relationships and marriage, one that is not being addressed. I hear all the time about how marriage is good for you and that it is the path to success, but not one word about how to go about finding that quality person who has the character and values to make a good spouse, when said persons are in very short supply. So those of us who do believe in marriage and are looking for a partner who feels the same way are in a sense being set up for failure. If people aren’t interested in relationships, you can’t wave a magic wand and make them interested. And the ones who do want relationships may have to learn to do without–or change their values. Just like in the workforce–if nobody is interested in doing a particular job, it just doesn’t get done and society will have to learn to do with less or do without entirely.
This is a good article especially when you talk about how men are afraid of the risk. I hope women understand that if a man is hesitant in investing financially into a woman (whether it’s paying for dates, dinners, marriage, etc.), it’s not necessarily because he’s cheap or stingy but because of the financial risk that’s involved. In an alternate universe where I am offered an absolute guarantee that the love of my life will stay with me forever but this guarantee costs me more than half my net worth, I will take this offer without hesitation and without skipping a beat . But since in our reality, the risk is too high, which forces me to be more prudent with my finances, I am accused of being cheap and stingy by women. I also hope women understand that if they want men to spend money on them then they need to find ways to make a man feel secure about his finances and this could mean making the man feel like you’re not a leech.
Wow. You made me figure out the true nature of my parents’ marriage. On the other side you nailed it when you say: “no one really wants a job. They want a job because of what a job can give them, namely money. They don’t really want the job, they want the money”. In some romance languages like French and Spanish the word to designate a job has its etymology on the latin word “tripalium”, an instrument of torture the Romans used with slaves. There’s no more to be said.
I think the ripple effects of these substitute online relationships can’t be overstated. Lots of men don’t learn how to talk to broader groups of people beyond their close associates, and lots of women lose any sense of reality with the market they eventually wind up dating in. In both cases, it just makes it harder to find a relationship when/if they decide they want one IRL.
Relationships aren’t really for men or women, they’re for children. And since children are disproportionately burdensome on women, women have typically sought to secure a man’s resources (time, attention, energy, money). So as more women have jumped on the childfree train, delayed motherhood, or prepared for the chance of single motherhood, fewer have relied on hetero relationships to secure those resources.
Fascinating, Orion. You have a great skill of explaining complicated topics in simple terms, and I agree with your assessment with regards to why men don’t get into relationships. I haven’t met many women that provide enough value for me to stay in a relationship with them. Having them simply show up without providing any traditional efforts whatsoever is no way to keep a man around. Gents, if you don’t have a girl putting effort in then she doesn’t like you like that. My mistake was experiencing a relationship where we both put in effort to the point that it turned into a positive feedback loop and we both ended up making each other very happy. That broke down due to religious differences, but that’s the dynamic I believe every man should aim for. Edit: by mistake I mean experiencing such a high-quality relationship will make it difficult for any woman coming after her.
This is pretty much how i have been living the last 6-8 years. My past relationships and observing women and how they react to me now that i am older and uglier. I’ve just been trying less and less. since i hit 23 its a repeat of never enough, not fit enough, not enough wealth not enough masculine tendencies, too much wealth too much muscle etc. Now that i am 30 and i am in the to 10% of income, there’s still better men out me who will snatch her away from my arms. So why bother tbh? i dont mind transactional relationships, its the way humans are but the way things are now is insane. I’m now concentrating on living a good life alone, I likely wont be a family man nor will I likely ever marry. Its sad but “it is what it is”, i never asked for this. I wanted to provide and care for a woman who provides so much less then me, I tolerated insane bullshit from women in the past. It was just never enough and there always was a better deal around the corner, so fuck it tbh. I give up
I agree with you, but there’s another part of the puzzle that I hope you can discuss another time, which is the time, energy, and money that different institutions and businesses demand from people once they start a relationship. When you think about it, society is demanding a lot from a couple that’s just trying to focus on their relationship. Society demands a lot more time at work, a lot more financial resources to keep up with the cost of living, and a lot more energy is needed just to keep up with those things. Furthermore, if a couple has a child, from the moment the child is born to college graduation, it’s potentially hundreds of thousands or, in some cases, millions of dollars for one child over at least two decades. That’s a lot of financial pressure to put on a couple. The couple won’t likely have the time to focus on their relationship if they’re focused on making money and finding the energy to maintain a life. It’s understandable why romantic relationships are on the decline.
This is a really brilliant and easy to understand analysis of what is happening. I see 2 tendencies in humanity: – Some learn to deal with this new technology trends, integrate them into a healthy lifestyle and help other people to do the same. – Some resist everything which is not artificial until they notice that the systems needed to maintain all these artificial occurrences entirely corrupted our whole biosphere (reminds me of the music article: “Noise” from Nightwish, which is basically a warning for us).
You spoke so much truth, men also seek sexual satisfaction on women they are not that attracted to, ones they have no intentions on taking serious, or “dates” as an alternative rather than risk wasting time and money to often times be rejected. Women usually have male friends that provide them the boyfriend experience without receiving “benefits” where they leverage the possibility of sex for as long as they can. It’s a sad world we live in as I am well aware of these dynamics. Where both parties outweigh risk vs reward and conclude that a relationship that requires work and investment, potentially provide a long term bond and satisfaction does not come out victor. Ig convenience will always sell.
Before the article plays, I’d like the write out why I don’t want a relationship. I’m a 23 yo male without my life in order, broke, no job, living with family, etc. Even if I had a job and money, my family would be an issue. I can sit here naming all of the issues I have, but instead I’ll simply say there are too many things to BURDEN onto someone that likes me. Quite honestly I don’t feel that I even deserved to be liked because of how much of a failure I have been. I don’t have real accomplishments, I don’t keep friends well because I push them away over time, I tend to not even be able to properly communicate with my own mother and grandmother. I love women, and I can tell when they’re interested in me. But instead of acting like there could be something, I realize they deserve better than me. Thanks for coming to my ted talk.
i’ve been saying this for year… noticed it yrs ago when i’d go out with my lady. we would go to restaurants, and the wait staff was surprised at us NOT using our phones, TALKING to each other in a real conversation, and enjoying each other’s company. the manager at one restaurant even gave us a FREE dessert because we, “were old school.” young women today: put on make-up, get dressed (or undressed) to STAY at home and post pictures online for TAR (time + attention + resources) from men. women do NOT have to meet men in-person, hold conversations, be interesting, and eventually GIVE UP SEX in order to keep a man’s attention. young men today: smoke weed, play article games online, and watch porn… crank off and ignore actually TRYING to get with a real woman. men do NOT have to approach, meet, hold conversations, be masculine/dominant and eventually GIVE UP RESOURCES in order to keep a woman’s attention. result: dating is dead, relationships are useless, and marriage is on life support. instead, people simply meet (online), hook-up, and go about their business. in this scenario, men are winning… as very little effort is required to get sex. the value of vagina is at an all-time low thanks to feminism, ’empowerment,’ and social media.
Well this one particular article just explained the dire situation relationships have been heading towards in the last 10 years because of social media and pornography incredibly well. I honestly recommend we share this as much as possible cause apparently it hasn’t fully caught on yet. It also seems to be taboo because it points out how women no longer need to engage in traditional relationships to get what they want and i’m sure that will be misconstrued as misogyny.
I disagree with “men don’t want to put in the work for relationship /sex because they find pron easier.” GenZ men WANT relationships, but women just don’t allow it because they are looking for the better deal, fall for the illusion on social media or are dating older guys. I read somewhere that females always dictate the rules of the sexual market place.
You always make me think. And most of the time I completely agree with you. On this one I have a slightly different take but not completely different … Ever since I saw Dr. Peter Gray do a TEDx talk on how the decline of free play in childhood is correlated with the rise of narcissistic behaviors, I can’t unsee it. That feels like the underlying issue here. Intimacy is scary and when people don’t know how to form relationships or interact with people because they did not get the appropriate level of freedom to play as children (absent adult supervision) they lack the necessary social skills to develop intimate relationships. And I agree with you there’s other places to satisfy their needs for attention, sexual stimulation, etc.. But ultimately, it’s a hollow win because we are designed for connection as a species and I really believe the fact that depression and anxiety are at a high is evidence that sex without connection (pornifird sex) and attention without connection (social media) is not fulfilling enough for people. I feel bad that this youngest adult generation seems primed for an intense midlife crisis, which I tend to think of as an opportunity for healing. Let’s hope for the best!
I think you’re right on point. I also think that it’s worth some additional consideration that due to the high tenancy of marriages, ending up in divorce, that this also highly influences young people, and their perception about the risks and rewards of relationships. After all young peoples first perception about love Fidelity, often first are imparted by their parents. So if they’re early perception of relationships is colored by their own parents to force, then it’s less likely that they’re going to have a fair perception of all relationships.
There was a time in my life when I truly wanted to believe that relationships actually involve love and mutual desire for one another. But an unrelenting slew of arguments like yours coupled with the fact that every relationship I’ve ever been in, has been a cataclysmic disaster that left me with horrible emotional scars has convinced me that this is the reality of the situation. So excepting that is the case, why then, would you want people to return to being in relationships? Why would you want people to be in a fundamentally dishonest pairing where they cynically extract sec and resources from one another when they could be honest about what they want and just pay each other openly for it?
Yeah… everything you said would be true if whole life satisfaction remained the same in and out of relationships over time. But it hasn’t and doesn’t. Well-being has been dropping as more people are individualistic. Aim for what you need, and you might get what you want. Aim for what you want, and you will only be disappointed, as history shows.
Sir, I ran across your page a few months ago and really came to like your articles. You make so much sense. As a single man at 52, and someone who has been around the world, I can see exactly what you are saying. I live in Turkey and just finished a tour of Eastern Europe a couple weeks ago. I went to Ukraine, Moldova, and Romania. I used to live in Ukraine many years ago. And as a single man, that was my Heaven on earth! 🙂 But this last time, it wasn’t so! I saw the difference in how women became, and even in Ukraine, they don’t seem to want relationships with anyone. Most women I met there said they were married or had boyfriends, but I think they are married or in so-called ‘relationships’ in order to satisfy their egos, because women never want to be totally single and alone. They are with men whom they probably don’t care for too much, and they do what ever they want, not caring what their man thinks or says. It’s a sad world!
Haha I’ve never been dreaming about getting married or having a family so my relationship situation was never crucial. However, on the back of my mind I still had a glimmer of hope to meet a person with whom I may connect deeply not just as a friend but romantically. There was something magical about this thought. When I finally met a person I felt something warm and exciting towards I even got brave enough to let them know about it. Only to be ignored (before that he had been showing signs of affections towards me too so idk what magic happened right after I confessed😂). Now I’m in my 20s and I don’t want to search for someone on purpose, cause this seems even more unnatural to me. Everyone keeps saying I’m… naive (to put it mildly), but I really don’t see any sense in trying search for something so fleeting and almost fictional as mutual love. Btw I have really close friends, passion for my hobbies, and a lot of love for this planet, people and animals. So I think my needs are covered without getting into a relationship. Romantic love is different, but I’m not sure it would made such a big difference in my life and well-being 🤔
The internet has ruined our species. Our need for socialization and community has been replaced with an online surrogate that has removed any need to physically interact. At nearly 30 I’m one of the rare few that was able to comprehend life before widespread internet take over, as well as mature into adulthood with it as a prominent part of life. I firmly believe my generations obsession with nostalgia is based on a instinctual urge to return to that pre internet time.
You are absolutely right, the problem I have with the world today is that at the same time we say “oh young people have stopped having sex”, we also say “sleeping around and hooking up is bad”, so what do we do then? me personally I just wanna find ONE good girl thats only for me, and I might have someone right now.. but I feel its a very tough problem overall. Cuz its like either way its gonna go wrong it seems? 100 years ago you would marry, then have sex, then children, it was much safer today no wonder theres so many single people its sad
This article appeared on my recommendation page an hour ago, so I am completely unfamiliar with you. I just visited your website to learn more and it stated that you are an award-winning scholar. I searched for your books and found a 2015 book titled, “Half the Time We’re Gone: The Effects of a Mindful Listening Task on Mind-wandering” but I was not able to actually find the book for review nor purchase. I found nothing else of your writings. I prefer to learn more before making pointed comments so I am curious to know your overall view and understanding of child development as it relates to adult individuals and society in general but browsing through your available articles I did not find a specific one about this foundational aspect of the human condition. Thank you.
I kindly disagree with the men bit. Men not only desire sexual opportunity, but also the comfort that only a woman can provide them. If you ever spend some time hearing incels complain about their problems, you’d soon realize it’s not an issue of sex. They can watch porn and go to prostitutes, and some do, but still feel miserable. Moreover, most men watch porn and that still applies to men within relationships. I believe the impact porn has on men’s relationship seeking efforts is taken out of proportion. Most of the reason men do not seek relationships is either because the competition and standards are too fierce or because they find women a potential liability (be it through divorce, baby trapping, resource draining, etc.)
I’m afraid I have to beg to differ on one thing. There’s no equivalence between porn for men and social media for women. Men don’t prefer porn, men retreat to porn. You’re not going to find many men who would choose to jerk their chicken instead of having sex and a living relationship with a woman who is attracted to them if that option were available. Onlyfans money isn’t virtual, it’s real money and many women would rather risk being one of many OF ‘creators’ who make peanuts or who end up stalked by fans than date an average guy. Women left men enmasse and men left alone, are now blamed for how they choose to soothe their loneliness as though they chose to be lonely. The loneliness came first and women can end it anytime they decide they want to date and raise families with the ordinary men they think they’re too good for in a world built on the toil of ordinary men
Spot on doc! I thought you already explored the depths of modern day dating psychology, then this bomb arrives. It is sad that both men and women exchanged the physical to virtual currency. Men always wanted feminine and beautiful women and their own offsprings. Now they get the most beautiful women without any clothes on their screen for free, in their privacy at home, and with VR, even interactive sex will be possible. Men will rather pay. Many people do not even want children, seeing how difficult things are nowadays and how society struggles to keep up with the amount of changes. Women in the modern age achieved what they ever wanted and more: they can have quality education, earn any amount of money, be successful in any field, own properties, and do generally whatever they want. They still find a way to sell their bodies and complain that they do not have EVERYTHING, they do not appreciate the many nice things they have already. Both sides are equally fucked. No wonder pets are so widely “used”, it is no longer about guarding the house or catching mice. It is about companionship. What used to be another human being, is replaced by animals, because they can love their owner, whoever they are and give you the comfort and love and they are excited you to get home. The pets though will never give some things people need: the intimacy they desire. You can have the best hobbies in the world, dozens of close friends, and pets, the most awesome place to live and a fulfilling job.
I’ve recently witnessed my own withdraw from twitch social media too, as I have a hard time making friends with my c-ptsd and since I’m a workaholic, I get my socializing from twitch. But as twitch declines and the content creators start looking for their next gig, it requires I adapt, but even then it’s sending me into survival mode of past relationships when they are not present
I’ve heard all these ideas in fragments, but you stitched them together beautifully. And it very much matches my experience as well. I’m abstinent for religious reasons, but I find myself chatting with girls online and exchanging time/attention (not money anymore) for sexual gratification. I don’t really want a serious relationship right now because I’m not really in a position to protect and provide for someone. Your take also sort of resembles the thought I’ve had, that relationships are now more like a luxury good than a necessity.
These utilitarian meta trends might be true for Gen Z, but people around me (I’m in my late thirties) are still entering relationships (or looking for one) and getting married so it does not really reflect my experience. Porn, OF and hookups might sound cool (and they are) when you’re twenty something but people eventually will grow tired of it and start craving real human connection and fall back to monogamous relationships again.
Porn is not trapping men. It’s a solution to a problem because women are so difficult today. So men are being logical. Women don’t want man? Man still has needs. Never met a man who chose porn over a woman. The problems start with women changing, continue with men not being able to support a household and end with hypergamy and the women choosing the top males. Leaving more than half the single males ignored. So as a man you can work 10, 20, 30 years for a woman to finally see you only because you have things or money or you can just check out because the juice isn’t worth the squeeze. Your character and who you are as a person doesn’t get women interested.
It’s just a game of moving the goal posts. If you’re dating women they want a committed relationship, ok then when you oblige they blame any bad acts on not being your wife. They can cheat because hey, we are not married. Then you marry them and they take 1/2 your stuff if they all of a sudden “aren’t happy anymore”.
I’ve always thought of Prostitution as being the fundamental socio-economic situation between the sexes. The oldest profession as they call it is the bluntest expression of the heterosexual transaction. As technology enriches and shapes our lives this natural transaction is at the core of our adoption.
I think another issue is that rotations and monkey branching has led to a form of pseudo-polyamory that is making serial monogamy less desirable. The individual relationships don’t matter as much because they can easily be swapped out for something better at a moment’s notice. Also, abundance mindset has led to an unwillingness to compromise on anything.
This is fascinating. They may know they are not in a good place in their life right now to handle one. Or they are experiencing life in such a busy way, that they actually do not have time( even though I think that is just an avoidant excuse for some). It may also be from fear or insecurity. They believe they are going to hurt others, or that relationships for them are doomed. Thanks.
I’d pretty much agree with this analysis, and I would add that it seems people are willing to take a counterfeit rather than the real thing, and maybe that’s because the real life sleep-around culture is also a counterfeit of truly meaningful life-building committed relationships which take work but are far more rewarding than the counterfeits.
In my experience, your analysis of current people is correct. I’m 62 years old: we didn’t used to see people that way, and so our experience of life was significantly different. It’s depressing to me that we Boomers raised girls that view themselves as whores and boys who view themselves as johns. This came from surgically removing our children’s human values and replacing them with material and corporate values. My recommendation to anyone younger than 60-ish: rebel. Google “humanity”, attempt to learn what that meant and learn to be human again. Disobey your corporate masters. Then try to find others who do the same.
I have discovered that mental stimulation and stimulating dialogue is really important to me jn a relationship. It’s something most people don’t think of but if you are dating, you want someone who can go head to head with you conversationally and that kind of compatibility is just as important as sexual compatibility. They tie together too as intelligence and wit are extremely sexy. I know Seinfeld had an episode where his two “heads” were battling it out and I totally get it now.
Fantastic and solid hypothesis. I also stronngly believe changes in serum concentrations of androgens and estrogens is a strong co-factor. If we want knowledge, we need data and the ability to perform experiments; and we need some measurable categories. I think we have that in this domain, the question is now to establish causality where we see correlation. Which way does the arrow point? How many co-factors do we have, and how do we perform the Principal Components Analysis? Maybe even more interresting: is it something that needs a fix? If so, what motivators are there, and who should apply them. Sorry, just geeking out on this, it is so interresting…
I agree with everything you said, but I think it’d benefit from a few additions. Not only have the reasons we’d enter relationships been digitally satisfied, modernity has given us further reasons to avoid them. The primary thing women are looking for in a relationship is emotional validation; even before time or material resources. Social media has made it clear to everyone with eyes and a brain that men think most of the things women are interested in are dumb and that men really don’t respect women’s opinions or care about what they think aside from how it affects their ability to form a relationship. Likewise men are also looking for someone to stand by him if the world turns against him and for a woman to be a mother to his children. The first was ruined by seeing their fathers and grandfathers emasculated and financially destroyed by no-fault divorce. Social media and pop culture have also made it difficult to trust that most women could become good mothers.
You are giving facts that I very much agree with (especially on the social media part), but I would base that on cases I see around me. Is it possible to provide studies on your articles that someone might use for further research or to support their opinions in a relevant discussion? Thanks for your articles anyway
Love it. And, I would add one thing, doc. Trading resources, time, attention, and money, does NOT guarantee sex with women, it only, perhaps, as you said, guarantees sexual OPPORTUNITY, not sex itself. I really want to harp on this distinction. Because, you can give a woman everthing you have, and not get sex in return. Porn on the other hand, is dirt cheap, just pay your internet bill, and it guarantees sex that, no woman can hope to live up to. Who knows how to make you orgasm better that you? This is why I have been on literally, THREE dates in the past 20 years, it is not worth it AT ALL!
I have a different spin to it but whole heartedly agree with what you said. Mine is there is little to no value to creating and maintaining relationships even though we all deeply want one aa well as all the benefits and perks that should come with one. Expectations and the lack of fulfillment and rewards on both sides have not only brought relationships, the creation and the maintenence of them to a grinding halt, but the fulfillment of wants and needs as well and the failures to implement them, work torwards them and taking action. Also similarly to what you have said. They meaning needs and wants have been replaced with cheap dopamine hits and opportunities. Social media, online dating, hookup culture, pornography, sex toys and dolls, self love culture, etc. All as coping strategies. Social reciprocity has been completely eliminated. Women have the abundance of options, are spoiled for choice, are gunning for the top 10% of men, are practically looking for Christian Gray, and the top 10% of men are returning them back to where they found them because they have all the options as well. The rest of the 90% of men like myself are recognize instantly a bad deal from a good one and are saying no thanks. The risk far outweighs the rewards.
A more fundamental question: is the trading of time, attention, resources, protection etc etc etc for sex a particularly fair trade? From a male perspective. Seems a bit sub-optimal to me. Not disputing the evolutionary reality of it, I’m just begging the question-even where the exchange is to occur and function as well as it can-isn’t it an altogether better arrangement for the female than the male?
I love the adventure of women. Seeing someone at a coffee shop, saying whatever is on the tip of my tongue and seeing what happens, figuring out when /whether or not to touch or move closer, the reactivness of the women, the way they react in ways that I could never predict but yet make so much sense. Just starting from a glance, smiling, seeing her smile back, I walk over and say hi, sit at her table and chat, and the whole time you never know what will come of it. It is a real life puzzle adventure game. It keeps me sharp. It requires me to be loose. It requires me to drop self jugdement. It incentivises me to be in good shape, and to be able to fight (because there is a real phenomena of haters) . Sex is “hard to come by” i.e. maybe 1% of women i approach are wanting to get laid by me. However, there’s nothing difficult about any of this usually. Its all fun and a game that costs NO MONEY to play
In the 90s, there was a sci fi series called SeaQuest. It was kind of Star Trek under water (and it was happening roughly in the current times). In one episode, the SeaQuest crew managed to travel forward in time roughly 200 years and found a world, empty of people. Turns out people spent the majority of their time in virtual reality and forgot to reproduce. Combine that with a plague that severely reduced the population (sounds familiar), the only thing that saved humanity were hatcheries (places where men and women would deposit their reproductive cells), governed by artificial intelligence. Sounds very familiar. And very horrifying.
This is so eye opening. Just that I am sad, that people tend to copy the same extraction syntheticising method that mankind applies to an exploited environment to exploit themselves and what relations have to offer because: obviously you never learn as much from a porn or a social media post as you learn and grow fron a relationship, same with relationship to our ‘environment’ which is our home earth with all the life in it. Instead we are pittying ourselves for how disappointet hurt and broken hearted we are and we turn away from connection as a whole and the dangers that come with it, picking just what we consider ‘safe enough’. I think, we shall trust much more in our instincts what a person is good for and what we cannot expect from them if we don’t fall for our own illusions about what someone should provide for us. It’s all so childish, making me think that we never had been the children we have deserved to be.
I would add that men’s sexuality in general is openly shamed by the public, so it’s very risky to date women. If you make an advance with a woman on a date and she has a poor experience, she can make your life a living legal hell. It’s very common and it happens more than you think. We need to stop shaming men for having normal human needs. There are too many bad actors who are playing the victim and using the court system to hurt men financially.
While sex is very important for me in a relationship (I even ended my last relationship also because of a poor sex life), it is by far not the only thing I want from a relationship. The emotional bonding, having someone that loves and understands you and also very importantly wants to start a family with you is also very important. I sometimes see a pattern in your articles that you think men only want sex from personal relationships with women. I mean, we cant deny that this is highly important but there are enough high value men out there who can have sex with various attractive women but choose to marry one particular women. I’m myself a porn addict btw, and porn doesnt make me wanna have a relationship any less.
I would add stress as a relationship deterrant. The stress of work, running a home, raising kids, trying to find time to enjoy life, managing finances while not making enough to live on, and doing it all with a very few community supports or a “village” to help. Western society can be very isolating for families. So i think young people are looking at it while correctly observing overwhelming failure and concluding “why bother!”. Also broken families are producing broken adults who can barely function which makes for shitty partners. And….the loss of connecting morals and value systems, ie. Religious beliefs.
Relationships are not really for men and women, they are for children. And because children are disproportionately burdensome for women, women tended to seek to secure men’s resources (time, attention, energy, money). Thus, as more women jumped on the childless train, put off motherhood, or prepared for the chance of single motherhood, there was less reliance on heterosexual relationships to conserve those resources.
Most people don’t want relationships due to the serious maladaptive coping strategies formed in childhood due to parental neglect, being raised by western education system which is literally a one to one recreation of Lord of the flies, and rampant consumerism that tells them happiness is something you buy. Society is the problem
Great article! I would have loved to hear about women avoiding relationships outside of the context of OF/Social Media, since it’s also a huge trend outside of those spaces. I did think that you were going to mention women seeking to provide resources and security for themselves. And looking to provide attention/time for themselves (solo dates, etc.), or emphasizing plantonic friendships and family. Truthfully alot of women avoid relationships because they feel like they don’t actually recieve the emotional/romantic fulfillment they are looking for. And in some cases they end up being more of a mother than a partner/wife to the man they are with, like voluntary single motherhood without the children yet. I know people always say “choose better” but its very common even with the “good/nice guys”. As a young woman I also hesitate to enter relationships because they can be quite draining.
Interestingly, some of the developed countries with the lowest birthrates (and declining marriage) in the world (Japan, South Korea) have sex-on-demand for any male with disposable income. In Japan, it is easily available in forms such as maid cafes, soap lands and room salons that are openly advertised. In South Korea it is a little more hush hush but every urban area has various massage services, room salons, and red light districts. From an online article about the sex industry in South Korea: “20% of men in their 20s pay for sex at least four times a month, with 358,000 visiting prostitutes daily.” The declining birth rates in both countries have been noted with a lot of hand wringing and various explanations, but you hit the nail on the head. By the way, this sex industry in South Korea and Japan is little known by outsiders because it is for local men only, unlike places such as Thailand.
I have mixed feelings about the transactional theory of relationships. On the one hand, men and women bring what value they have to a relationship and there is no point in ignoring that. On the other hand, people in relationship are not commodities. The best relationships are subtle and surprising, possessing an enduring glimmer of mystery and infinite possibilities within the relationship. You can’t reduce that to an equation or an economic proposition. I might argue that the commodification of relationships in any time period actually gets in the way of people finding and creating the kinds of relationships that really flourish and nourish the soul as well as the body.
I feel in years to come relationships will be a thing of the past. People today are addicted to money and materialism and don’t care about the humanitarian comforts relationships and marriage has provided for previous centuries. I never cared for porn like a lot of people do. The thought of being turned on by people screwing on a screen flick I always thought was really stupid. The real thing is always much better
Would welcome your take on this for women and men in their 40s and 50s. I think women in their late 40s and 50s have such high expectations before entering a relationship because they already have so-called “financial independence”, homes, grown kids, hobbies, pets etc (and aren’t leveraging only fans etc) so if the guy isn’t a 9/10 with a six or seven figure income, such women just keep playing the field, hook up with younger men etc rather than engage in a committed relationship with a man closer to their age and income level etc.
I respectfully disagree, in a way. I dont think men are looking ONLY for sexual fulfillment. I get tired of these pundits-men and women- who think that is all men care about. I feel men also crave the OPPOSITE of their nature- the feminine(vunerability, submissiveness, nurturing, etc) ‘energy’ if you will. And they need to feel needed. Women, in my opinion, also not only want resources, but also sexual fulfillment, and masculine( assertiveness, decisiveness, strength, etc) ‘energy’
What about those women who don’t even use any online platform, and also dislike and stay away from relationships? I know a 26 yr old girl and she’s never been in a relationship before, when I asked her she says that she doesn’t want to waste her feelings on a temporary basis. I think she just wants the security of marriage first?
Excellent article! This is definitely part of the puzzle. I think the biggest reason for men using porn to simulate sex isn’t a choice rather it is a escapism because in the modern age simply put most women are not interested in average men. Women have access to an abundance of attractive men through social media and dating apps so why would they date average guys, its becoming more and more common that women are willing to share attractive men rather than have to settle with a less attractive one.
What good are modern relationships? Marriage is a contract that rewards women for breaking it. Men are made to feel like failures because women have been brainwashed to believe they all derve the perfect man, and no human being, man or woman, is perfect. Most young men I know engage in hookups and one-night stands, and tell the woman as little as possible. Some use false names. They do it so the woman can’t sue them or make false after they wake up in the morning and decide they made a mistake.
Life Coach Schahrzad Morgan did a similar vid recently on Why Men Don’t Want Relationships, her take was it was too much emotional labour, energy, investment and time which women thrive on as they are emotionally driven. Yes men do want relationships but as Richard Cooper (Entrepreneurs In Cars) the little juice (or benefits) one gets is not worth the squeeze
I agree. It’s down to the same problem as everything else: we’ve ‘gained’ the ability to manipulate our environment to extremes that have obsoleted our natural signaling. Our neurochemicals are confused by the powerful perfumed scent in the air, and can no longer smell anything organic. Life has slipped away from us: we’ve replaced the jungle with concrete
The main thing for me is that it’s next to impossible to find someone who doesn’t beat around the bush and play games or keep you guessing what there feelings are and that’s just trying to start a relationship and at that point I’m already mentally exhausted from work and life that I would rather not get into a relationship
I’m not going to defend feminism 100%, but there is some truth to the fact that relationships have always been a burden. We’re brainwashed about true love and living a dream, when people don’t even know how to properly treat each other. Men want sex and something more physical, women are usually seeking something immaterial, like depth in a relationship. So, the problem is there is no middle ground between men and women.
I say men do want relationships but its far harder for men to get them than before. Women have all the power. Especially the 18-25 demographic. Most 18-25 year olds ain’t going to pay men similar to that age with any attention unless they got money or look like a chad. They usually go after the 30+ year old guys or focus on stuff like onlyfans. Once a woman gets to their 30 they start to feel the pressure to find a man and their standards go back down to where they should of been. Problem now is all the men at their age bracket is going after the younger women since most spent time and resources improving themselves. They’re not going after relationships but more so one night stands and FWB since most women in their 20’s just want to have fun. Creates this endless cycle of no one wanting to really hookup.
The message here is that people don’t want to love, but only be loved. But if that’s true, people are unlovable – and unable to love. And yet love is all this website is on about. Because, people love despite hating themselves for it. But love is the antithesis of transaction, it’s sacrifice, and that sticks in the craw because it sets you up as a sucker in this foolish world. People who love die on crosses and all that.
The sad fact is that by the time most people have “intimate” relationships with numerous people, they become a shell of the human they once were… there is no going back to the “old you” after so many “partners”…. finding true “love” is hopeless after this ….. we are going to die alone…. it is what it is
Depends on where you live and grow up, because here it is still an embarrassment to not be married by the time one reaches 35-50yrs old. You are to some degree labeled immature, unlucky or selfish, undesirable, abnormal, etc. I also think it’s wrong to say men are looking for women just to have sex. It’s a significant reason, obviously, but not everything. The porn star isn’t going to jump out of the screen and take you to the hospital when you have a heart attack or slip and mess up your hip when you are older, or hold you when you feel vulnerable, or listen to you babble about life, or cook you dinner, or have your child etc.
As a man, I feel like porn can’t give 20% of the experience that actual sex with another person gives. However, my relationships with women have been disappointing. Either long distance, or lack of attraction, or a slow painful decline. I’m not willing to trade frustration or pain for sex. I have my limits.
My last serious relationship was 46 when I was 36. For six months she was wonderful and sweet. I finally told her that I loved her/had fallen in love with her she lovingly saying she felt the same. . Shortly after my father died a month later she suddenly broke up with me. To “focus on herself and other cliches. Two weeks later she began another relationship with ” and old friend ” she came back after six months saying she still loved me. Didn’t mention the guy. We moved in together. I found xxl condoms in her drawer after she’d asked me to grab her keys. She’d spent six months driving two hour to screw this old friend of hers. She mentioned that he was uncomfortably large and I was so much of a better fit for her body. Which I guess didn’t stop her from leaving me and driving hours to see him for six months every weekend immediately after telling me she had fallen in love with me. I thought I could finally trust someone. A woman ten years older than me but spending six months getting a larger hung guy was more important apparently than me or my love for her. She’s pretty so she moved on and married an older rich retired millionaire. She’s the last person I’ve dated or been in a relationship with since. She never apologized. She entered into my life and led me on lied then sexually humiliated me. Then tried to act like it was no big deal. Fourteeen days (allegedly) she ran into her old friend at a July 4th party. Doubt it was a coincidence since big guy lived in another city. But 14 days was how quickly her love for me was forgotten.
Seems like a very superficial analysis. You say men seek relationships because they want “sexual opportunity.” And that’s as far as your analysis goes. You don’t acknowledge any other desires or needs besides “sexual opportunity” — i.e., the desire to have sex. Is that all you think men want out of relationships? Not emotional attachment? Not a person to connect with, to share life with? Someone to love and care for? Perhaps someone to have a family with? Just someone to bang? That seems like an awfully superficial starting point for any analysis.
You mentioned only fans and tinder and I would agree. I would also add that I think a lot of women (and to an extent men too) are getting a lot of their emotional needs met on facebook. I think facebook is more insipid as there is a greater illusion of “I have all these friends” who like me and validated me.
Almost all the discussions in this area seem dominated by the feelings and problems of men and women between 18 and 25. In my day, when you hit 21, it was time to put away childish things and start being an adult. For various reasons, many people defer that transition to their late 20s. People did not use to care what happened to people between 18-21. Since the new threshold is 26, then we should stop caring about the greater significance of anything that those people do. Once men and women hit the big 26, their mental focus seems to change. Though I personally think they wasted 5 years with little to show for it, that is their call. After all, most of them will live to 90 or 95. As the ancient sages stated, youth is wasted on the young. Also, though I liked the late Kevin Samuels, his statement that hanging out in clubs and having sex with strange women night after night was great prep to being a business exec is extremely wrong. Calderone has it right: no young man has any business being in a club unless he owns the club.
Interesting stuff. I would argue that the safety aspect of corn (and related stuff) for men is underrated (e.g., STDs, pregnancy, divorce grape and assault allegations). Also, assuming that the average woman wants children more than the average man, I would argue that the biggest loser in this virtualization of intimacy is women and society as a whole (where there is likely to to be increasing child/future tax payer shortage).
Youre right about that. If it wasn’t for the sex, I wouldn’t have tolerated my ex for even a moment and I mean that quite literally. But after enough sex, enough masturbation, you start to desire what actually matters: personal connection. To love and be genuinely loved in return, is the most satisfying thing a human can do. To at long last be TRULY understood, desired, and respected. At this point, the prospect of holding hands with a genuine lover in a park would be 10x more satisfying than mere sex. And yet, even that is extremely hard to accomplish in this era. No one understands one another, and no one wants to. I don’t know if it’s out of fear, pure selfishness, or both. But too many individuals will DIE ALONE because of that, and I don’t intend on being one of them.
you’d be surprised, tinder is full of men saying they want something serious and are fed up of women who are only looking for sex… you’d be surprised at how many women are only looking for sex with nothing in return apart from the sex. the way i see it is people are either looking for sexual satisfaction, or emotional satisfaction, and if they are really optimistic they are looking for both with one person.
Because of all the stuff so eloquently described in this and other websites: You can’t show someone you like them or their attraction goes down. You can’t tell someone something you like about them or their attraction goes down. If someone says they like you don’t say it back or they’ll think “meh, that was too easy!” Don’t respond to someone’s text straight away. When a woman pulls away then comes back it’s because it didn’t work out with the guy she preferred to you. Women have 4 or 5 guys at any one time. If an ex texts you saying “I miss you” or “thinking about you” she’s just looking for a short term dopamine hit. Monkey branching. Women don’t love men, only their kids. Hypergamy. A lifetime of shit testing and if you “fail” just one she immediately starts looking for other options. The dual mating strategy. All largely true but Christ, who the hell wants to have to navigate all that?!
This trend will benefit men in the long term and hurt women. As technology advances, AI will replace real women on OF. Robot women will also eventually become available so once that happens men can have sex any time they want with no worries. Women on OF will eventually age out and their source of attention and revenue will go away leaving them with no future. No men will want to take on their financial and emotional burden. It will be difficult if not impossible for them to find employment. Most men would prefer to have sex with a real woman but the feminist entitlement attitude modern women possess makes men not want to deal with them so masturbation becomes enough. Once the robots are invented (and become affordable) men will have no reason to bow to a woman’s demands. All of this will result in the end of civilization. The only hope is for a complete reset. I’m not sure how that would manifest itself. Maybe a resurgence of religion? I don’t know.
I feel this is missing the negative effects that the internet has had on relationships and the destruction of the traditional family. Living life for your own gratification only is an empty and hollow existence. No amount of money or social status will ever compare to the day you first hold your child, or first time they learn to ride a bicycle or so many other firsts. When I die, it is my fondest hope that my friends and family will care less about how much money I made or what vacations I took, but how much love I had for them and how I inspired them to be better.
Some of your other talks are great, but this one is poor. The idea that men only, or mainly, want relationships for ‘sexual opportunity’ is a false premise. A good relationship offers far more than that. The main reason for the decline of romantic relationships is that the manufactured ‘gender war’ has produced a huge amount of animosity between the sexes, and it’s very hard for relationships to thrive or last in this poisoned mental environment.